In Praise of Ugly

CCP Rise wrote:
"About the Mammoth: I just checked in with Art briefly and they confirmed that they simply don't like the way the Mammoth looks. I'll point them to this thread and see what they have to say about your feedback =)"

I'd like to point out that I didn't say that, that was written by CCP Rise.

This puts into some context the following thread regarding Indy balancing changes. Which you should read thru if you have all the time in the world. And also my own post on that thread, which you should read because it is worth it and very funny.

I have to tell you right up front that I couldn't care less about Indy ship class balancing. I'm extremely confident that it will all get worked out and CCP will do their usually good job of making it work. There are other people much more passionate and knowledgeable about such things. I am smart enough to let them handle the details about ships I rarely, if ever, actually fly.  I do, however, care about design. And while no one came right out and said they were going to change anything, the implication in that statement above was enough to spur me to say what needed to be said.

Thank you for not liking the look of the Mammoth. By coming forward and revealing your disdain for the "look" of this horribly ugly ship you have revealed your intelligence. The Mammoth IS ugly, it was beaten quite hard with the ugly stick. It hit every branch in the ugly tree when it fell out of production. It is soooo ugly it would make a freight train take a dirt road!
This is the entire point of both the Mammoth and the Hoarder, they exist to be ugly. If indeed, they are on the block for revision, then they need to be V3'd to be even more ugly in high-resolution. You have streamlined and purty-fied far to many Minmatar ships, the Industrials need to stay horribly ugly. That is their character, the entire summation of hurried, clunky, use what is at hand MInmatar design philosophy.
I am encouraged by your obvious attention to detail, it has only taken you ten years to realize the obvious - the Mammoth is freakishly butt ugly. Not every ship in Eve needs to be streamlined perfection, we need and demand our ugly be respected, admired and enhanced. It adds character to homogenization.
Keep the Mammoth ugly. In fact, it could stand to be even worse in my opinion.

There is a lot of ugly in Eve. One can argue the specifics to personal taste, but certainly the Mammoth is among the prime examples. The Moa is another one that jumps to mind. Saying that something is ugly however is different than saying it needs changed. In fact, it is often the opposite. Ugly can sometimes be beautiful, or functional, or traditional, or a combination of all of those things and more. Ugly has a place in design. ( While pure ugliness does not, unless the artist is intent on making a statement, this edges us from design into "art" and we'll leave that to other debates for now. )

My post was certainly a tad out of context given the original OP of that thread. I was aware of that. If one reads the entire 17 previous pages one will notice, as most threads do, the original intent wanders a bit off track. My post was intended to do exactly what it did, establish the fact that the Mammoth - and other ugly ships of Eve - do not need to be aligned, straightened, smoothed, perfected or otherwise "fixed" from a visual standpoint. We need their ugly, we want their ugly and we love their ugly.

V3 those skins, enhance them, high-res 'em for future generations, but don't go changing the fundamental wonder that makes each ship uniquely that ship. That was the mistake with removing the frill from the Vagabond. And with the Comet.

Balance to your hearts content. But don't change something just because it might be a tad ugly.

"No object is so beautiful that, under certain conditions, it will not look ugly."
- Oscar Wilde

That was my point.


  1. and, Mammoth is back to the largest capacity industrial, thank god

  2. I don't know if the Mammoth is ugly. It looks like someone bolted a bunch of shipping containers together and strapped an engine on the back. That's more utilitarian then ugly.

  3. "I have to tell you right up front that I couldn't care less about Indy ship class balancing. I'm extremely confident that it will all get worked out and CCP will do their usually good job of making it work."

    Unfortunately, the I don't care its not teh ship I fly mentality means that they won't do the job right. I think I'm the only in the person to ask the obvious followup question, if the cargo sizes are being changed from the current racial specialties (i.e. Min and Gal superior), will that carry over to freighters? I bet a lot more people will care about a nerfed Charon, that's for sure.

  4. Maybe I have too much geeky imagination, but the lines of the Mammoth remind me of the Battlestar Galactica...I'd hate to see them take that beaten down, hard hit survivor look out of the ship.

    1. Seriously though, I've never flown a mammoth nor wanted to because I've always attached myself to the Gallente for whatever reason... be it their strive for freedom or just the name... but regardless... Make it more ugly as Rix stated in his post. Put some more rust on it, maybe strap a few more cargo containers off the side and make it a bit more imbalanced to give it more of Minnie feeling. Thats the look they've gone for from the Minmatar right? Whats that saying about minmatar ships? Falling down a flight of stairs with uzi's strapped to your wheelchair... if one falls off it doesn't matter because it was out of ammo anyways... or something like that? THAT, to me, screams what the Minmatar culture is all about. FREEDOM!


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